Comments on: Reading the Jay Bybee memo from August 1, 2002

By: Rafe

Rafe — Fri, 26 Feb 2010 19:28:29 +0000

Let’s be clear, he wasn’t exonerated. The DoJ suggested that he be cited for professional misconduct but the Office of Professional Responsibility declined to do so. But both the report on Bybee and the Margolis’ ruling that explained why the OPR was not referring the case to his state bar made it perfectly clear that his work was very shoddy indeed.

By: Rick Jones

Rick Jones — Fri, 26 Feb 2010 16:04:07 +0000

Doc Holiday, Mr. Bybee doesn't need to undergo your version of interrogation, the Justice Department just cleared him of wrongdoing. And, that is from a DOJ that doesn't agree with the methods he correctly cited as legal. When folks who had prejudged him when they opened their investigation now say he did not conduct professional misconduct, then you know he has clearly been wrongly charged.

Btw, in your fictional scenario you had Mr. Bybee being interrogated in Arabic, that would be extremely unproductive unless he speaks that language. When we interrogate a foreigner we do speak to them in a language in which they are conversant.

By: Jason

Jason — Fri, 24 Apr 2009 16:46:16 +0000

Here’s my rule of thumb: If we as a nation get up in arms when other countries do it to our soldiers, we shouldn’t do it to anyone whether they be classified as terrorists, enemy combatants, or soldiers. Waterboarding immediately fails that test.

By: Donna Tagliaferri

Donna Tagliaferri — Thu, 23 Apr 2009 23:02:17 +0000

Again attacking Jay Bybee is a mistake. You know nothing about him and have no idea what he can survive. The problem with these situations is we make judgements without information. People are destroyed with almost no care, Jay Bybee put far more time into the memos than Doc Holliday did with his opinion. Be critical thinkers not sheep

By: Donna Tagliaferri

Donna Tagliaferri — Thu, 23 Apr 2009 22:56:55 +0000

One thing you have missed is the information that was gleaned from Abu Zubaydah….Be very careful of your opinion of Jay Bybee….he is a fine judge, a fine man and his memo helped keep our country safe. This is political…..in Garafalo’s words…straight up.

By: Kristina

Kristina — Thu, 23 Apr 2009 01:30:54 +0000

I’ve read the Bybee memo and legal definitions of torture too, and do not agree that the enhanced interrogation techniques constituted torture. Obama is naive, inexperienced, politically motivated, and self-interested – and it is sick. He is risking the security of our country. The people that we are using these enhanced interrogation techniques on are dangerous terrorists who are plotting to severely harm our country. Does Obama think the CIA can sit down and have tea with them, and politely ask them to disclose everything they know, and somehow they will?

By: John

John — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 17:59:35 +0000

David, Although I agree that each person has different tolerances to interrogation techniques, the problem with using a "definition of torture [that] necessarily includes a component which accounts for a person’s character and life experiences" is in it's application. It's completely arbitrary. The person administering the "enhanced interrogation techniques" is unlikely to be able to unbiasedly and accurately determine what is "proper", as their motivation is to extract information.

And I disagree that our nation is "degraded by lack of real-world experience and excessive utopian intellectualization". Rather, it is degraded by people who believe it's proper and allowable to uphold the moral ideals of this country by committing immoral acts.

By: David Loomis

David Loomis — Wed, 22 Apr 2009 02:45:10 +0000

I have read the Bybee memoranda, and I conclude that the decision to employ enhanced interrogation techniques were not undertaken recklessly or even casually. I have also read all of the “legal” definitions of “torture,” and I cannot conclude that waterboarding, head slapping, exposure to temperature extremes or insects, etc. are included within the definitions. None of these experiences is more than we require in Marine boot camp and School of Infantry. All Marines must endure exertion to the limit of physical and mental endurance, sleep deprivation, temperature extremes, and many temporary injury-inflicting experiences, including the “gas chamber.” Most, if not all, Marine Scouts enjoy waterboarding as part of their training. In fact, as a teenager in the Boy Scouts, I and many of my friends subjected ourselves to worse on backpacking survival exercises in the Sierras. So, I hope most people would agree that the definition of torture necessarily includes a component which accounts for a person’s character and life experiences. In the cases at issue, the recipients of enhanced interrogation procedures were mid- and high-level leaders of uber-violent organizations proficient in bombings and beheadings, and I submit that the definition of torture for these people is significantly different from what it would be for ordinary soldiers acting on behalf of an organized nation-state. Frankly, I view the analysis in the foregoing blog as the product of a soft life with few mental or physical challenges, and I worry that our nation is degraded by lack of real-world experience and excessive utopian intellectualization.

By: DocHolliday

DocHolliday — Sat, 18 Apr 2009 05:29:59 +0000

I think if Mr. Bybee would volunteer and then was taken by surprise immediately to an unknown location and undergoes the interrogation techniques by Arabic speaking strangers for the duration of Abu Zubaydah's interrogation without admitting what he is undergoing is torture then I would be willing to exonerate him.

But, I seriously doubt he has the fortitude, stamina or resolve to do so.

By: Rogers Cadenhead

Rogers Cadenhead — Fri, 17 Apr 2009 13:48:24 +0000

Clearly, Bybee has read his Joseph Heller. Torture is OK because it isn't torture, and if it was torture we wouldn't be doing it. Please hand me that electric wire and expose the prisoner's nutsack.

"There was only one catch and that was Catch-22, which specified that a concern for one's own safety in the face of dangers that were real and immediate was the process of a rational mind. Orr was crazy and could be grounded. All he had to do was ask; and as soon as he did, he would no longer be crazy and would have to fly more missions. Orr would be crazy to fly more missions and sane if he didn't, but if he was sane he had to fly them. If he flew them he was crazy and didn't have to; but if he didn't want to he was sane and had to. Yossarian was moved very deeply by the absolute simplicity of this clause of Catch-22 and let out a respectful whistle."
"That's some catch, that catch-22," he observed.
"It's the best there is," Doc Daneeka agreed.